you are NOT allowed to doubt obamacorn!!!! he's black.   See 22 other replies

Once again, by all accounts, the reference to page 50 that is being passed around in chain emails does indeed refer to the anti-discrimination clauses that I linked to. I thought you could read it yourself and that would be enough. But maybe you need it explained?Nearly every fact checking and rumor debunking website I've seen will do that for you. Take your pick:http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2009/jul/30/chain-email/no-free-health-care-illegal-immigrants-health-bill/http://factcheck.org/2009/08/twenty-six-lies-about-hr-3200/http://mediamattersaction.org/emailchecker/200909010008http://healthcareforamericanow.org/site/content/fight_the_smears
But I'm sure you're right, ya know, with your proven track record, unbiased intentions, dedication to a fair and thorough analysis of the facts, reliance on proven sources, your law degree... It's these other guys who are mistaken I'm sure.   See 22 other replies

Again, you shoot another blank with the website you offered. And BTW, what you're quoting was not "page 50", but is about a totally unrelated topic. I really don't see anything to respond to here. I think you've already stepped over the threshold of reasonable debate, and are casting wide at this point. I'll stand by the first 2 entries on this page as being what is at the core of this issue.   See 22 other replies

Uh, no. Page 50 is about prohibiting discrimination in health care.http://www.opencongress.org/bill/111-h3200/text?version=ih&nid=t0:ih:459SEC. 152. PROHIBITING DISCRIMINATION IN HEALTH CARE.(a) In General- Except as otherwise explicitly permitted by this Act and by subsequent regulations consistent with this Act, all health care and related services (including insurance coverage and public health activities) covered by this Act shall be provided without regard to personal characteristics extraneous to the provision of high quality health care or related services.I bet you think the section that reimburses people for the cost of getting professional counselling on end-of-life decisions is actually a "death panel" too...It's your choice to selectively read these things in some wacky, conspiracy-expecting way, influenced by chain emails and freerepublic right wing ramblings to be predisposed to think that way. It's your choice to seek out that which feeds your biases and then expect that what you find accurately reflects reality. It's your choice to believe that after all that, you still are able to distinguish reality from fiction. But I just don't think that works.   See 22 other replies

Actually, the 'Page 50' thing IS true. "All non-US citizens, illegal or not, will be provided with free healthcare services." They may not be legally eligible, but there is noting to stop them from getting full-coverage under the public plan. And if their daily lives are already all about claiming to be American citizens, how much of crisis of conscience are they going to have when one of them is sick or injured? Probably none. If this bill passed as it's written, I'm sure we could count on at least 90% of illegal immigrants receiving the benefits as needed.   See 22 other replies

So, you repeated the lie about this "page 50", then quickly accused the president of lying. Now you admit you were wrong. So now this then? Okay.There is no reason to prevent illegal aliens from paying the full price of health insurance. In fact, that saves money because we don't have to pay for ER visits, not to mention the savings from not not having infectious disease passed along. The public option (which probably will not come into existence) is not a free health care option. It is full price health insurance option. Preventing illegal aliens from having any subsidies means they pay full price. They are already ineligible for federal health programs under current law anyway. About half of illegal aliens already have health insurance, BTW. And not everything need to be spelled out in laws, especially when it is covered under current law. For example, the law necessitates that somebody in the government has to pay somehow for medical care, but nowhere does it spell out that somebody needs to write a check. How can they pay without language spelling it out? A government department is charged with implementing regulations to carry out the goals of the legislation.   See 22 other replies

The problem with the way these documents are drafted now, is that similar to the Patriot Act, they are worded in such an abiguous way that many translations are possible. I wouldn't be so worried about this experts interpretaion, but rather by the fact that it CAN be interpreted and implemented in this way, and possibly many others. A lot of the things contained in the Patriot Act have not been implemented -- not yet anyway. These kinds of bills make it so that lawmakers have a wide open field from which they can craft new legislation as the need arises. Do you trust your politicians? I suppose if they're Democrats you can trust them right? We don't need checks and balances when there's a democrat in office.   See 22 other replies